Why would any Protestant create a phony link and then have a Catholic post the link???. GL, Brett Jesus forgave those who repented. Rather than engage the *real issues* in this whole debate, such as the arguments Dr. White has presented to Dr. Beckwith against certain Roman Catholic doctrines, everyone has decided to focus on two pictures and a mans character. It started with the Creation, continues to the Garden of Eden with its Tree of Knowledge, the flood, the Ark of the Covenant, Sodom and Gomorra, the Paschal lamb, the kingship of David, the bronze serpent, the bones of Elisha, the mud and spit used by Christ, Christs shadow, Christs very body and blood, the Apostles, the Church, the tribulations, the seals broken in Heaven, the water, the fire, the war between good and evil, and the marriage between Christ and His Church. Boor. For example, you can choose any other kind of flower that is your favorite, or other colours that match better with your vibe. The expectation that people drop whatever theyre doing and answer Benigne dicis. Simply Amazing. thread and see how it unravelled there. Wasnt there a guy who was good at this, whats his nameChick or something? the ediface of his argument is an illusion, I apologize to everyone for the long post, but CareBear seems to wish that the quotations from Mr. White be addressed. But there are some acts against others that go to disrespecting their equality as a fellow human bearing the clear mark of their Creator in the workings of their mind and soul. Esau should have pages more written about him because he has intentionally argued fallaciously, i.e. Are you considering the original context, author, audience, and the genre of what you are reading (didactic, poetry, etc.)? Living word. Stop twisting things. The poster in question had to go down the entire page in order to post a reply; he mischaracterized a large number of posts in order to make his point, which is that he believes the indignation is too thick, and disagrees with the entire point of the post. For the record, I think White did behave poorly in questioning Beckwiths honesty. I would like to ask anyone who claims that the Roman Catholic Church, as it exists today, has existed for nearly 2000 years, to explain something to me. This is not my attempt to end the discussion on this thread by Argumentum Ad Verecundiam nor is it meant to be arrogant and presumptive. I truly know how Doug Wilson must feeldaily. Please give a specific example. Actually, Id be obliged if you could think of a third option? The only way you can defeat it is what you just did, dont engage it, but engage something that looks kind of like it or, in plainer terms, STRAW MAN. Of course, such isnt true of God, so this really isnt that important an issue. Gosh! So I will stand up and say when people have boldly crossed the line.). My Reply Catholics and Protestants both believe what they say it says. Dont feed the energy creature, as Mark Shea used to say. The comment has nothing to do with your race, gender, faith, sexual preference, political affiliation, or physical appearance. Spent over an hour going over my best recommendation for how to reach the Witnesses at your door. A coloured floral tattoo like this one may just be what you need to add vibrance to your skin. Greek grandeur is greatly infused within Alpha Omega tattoos. How about you summarize it for me, so I at least have something to work with, instead of just rewriting what I said and ignoring the willingness to hear the arguments, if not through reading the actual book in the next 5 minutes. Really, folkssimply admitting the man screws up in his arguments and behavior does not behoove you to become Catholic. It might be saying the person was not being logical or didnt understand. Final Dividing Line of 2022. Sorry. But HOW does he do this? it is easier that way. Which is correct, and to what authority shall we go for the correct interpretation? You answered how you determine what is scripture and what is not? As I see it, the analogy was spot on. Jessica if you feel a need to forgive myself and the host of this site for being Catholic, go for it. Alex Islamist= radical Muslim, not to be confused with the non-murderous Muslims. No sensible person would buy a website with the name of a fellow who hates him and direct it to his own web site. But I will reveal the truth to you: Its too late to save James White. Maybe he repents but you dont know it. White, J. R. Scripture Alone, Bethany House Publishers, Bloomington, MN, p.100-103. Take a look at the appendix to the second edition of Chosen But Free by Norman Geisler. The fruit of Christs life in our lives is not an option. Is Jesus truly God, truly Man, both, or some combination of the two? Perhaps you do with the rest of the Akin crew, as Akin seems to have used the pictures and some dubious Law from wikipedia to claim victory. Shut em down now, Jimmy. Pretty much actually. Carebear and Lane, Instead of apologizing he makes even more outrageous statements. from Columbia I am in the wilds of eastern Mississippi but we got a program in anyway! What Does a Christian Need to Know About Roman Catholicism? 4. No, I didnt. teach the heresy of Lordship Salvation. I can see that I see you mindlessly follow an Internet Apologist such as James White! It just goes to demonstrate how INEXCUSABLE someone elses claims were! His disciples were empowered. Books of Chronicles The common thread is a way of letting off steam, privately or at least non-publicly, in order to continue their job of preventing injury or death. Tech Postal Code:92517 May God grant him wisdom, patience, and good humor as he juggles us rabid Cat(holic)s and hands down the faith with the graces he has been given. What I did was take my opening statement from my debate with Shabir Ally on this topic from London in November of last year, along with my comments on Deuteronomy 18:18 from the preceding On November 13, 2019, James White debated Shabir Ally at Georgia Tech in Atlanta, GA on the topic Tawhid or Trinity: Is God One or Three Divine Persons? Greg McR: Question: if the Bible is 100% Gods Word (as I believe as well), why do we talk about Paul, Peter, Matthew, etc. So gracious that I wish we all could model ourselves after that shining example of Roman Catholic apologetics. Alpha & Omega 115 Trucker Hat. If White were thinking rationally, he would see this. Everybody knows that thinking people express themselves with cat macros. Your original question was why we go to Priests to have our sins loosed. Its amazing what having people around does for how one acts. I thought it would be cool to let folks get in touch via Zoom and ask about a textual variant they particular are interested in. Foxfier, They are not charitable. Bingo, Francis 03. 2 Timothy 2:24-26 The Lords servant must not quarrel; instead, he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. I certainly havent, and dont intend to. Enoch Bill912, Its kind of part of the package deal of being a confessing sinner. No such sign was given to the dead hierarchy of Jesus day but the resurrection of Jesus Himself, and it is still the best expression of why primitive, authentic Christianity cannot be equated to a particular denomination. Satanic counterfeit Bible versions also And, as he is becoming more stupid, I can only imagine it as a sign that he is moving closer to Rome 1Tm 3:15: Youre just employing sarcasm alone which would lead anyone to believe you dont have anything substantative to add to it so, can I safely assume argument is over and all this hubub about Dr. White always being so wrong is a fabrication of a bunch of people who have never actually read Dr. White to begin with? That is, why would Catholic anybody (e.g., Catholic Answers, Jimmy Akin, or especially the Catholic Church) actually engage in such an act? Not only that, but attributing negative intention to Catholics for what they themselves contributed to. White is the director of Alpha Chi rho tattoos are related to Jesus and Christianity, as the X and P are the first two letters of the Greek word for Christ. They had a sacred book that provided an explanation of history which so far transcended every other explanation as to be unquestionable. People on both sides have used weak and strange arguements, I have never seen anything like it to be honest. Recommended reading can be taken up by those inclined. At which point, my Ironymeter explodes. Come on, Carebear, Churchmouse! Registrant City:Riverside I cannot believe that Christians are defending those caricatures of Catholics as insane people who, if they disagree with you would riot, and cause physical harm to you. they dont go anywhere. If defending against the irrational, overly-emotional, cry-wolf attitude of ten or twelve fanbois makes you ashamed to be a Christian, you need to seriously ask yourself some questions. Here are some statements that youve made today: What knowledge of the canon was established? I really hope that you would read Dr. Whites book. My parents and loved ones dont blindly follow the work of an internet apologist, regarding him and his work with blind fervor and zeal, hypocritically asking for things that they themselves dont offer. Bartholomew the disciple came to me in a vision and revealed to me a secret special knowledge: Q reads too many Ehrman and Pagels books. The simple fact is: Jimmy is willing to be cross-examined in public on his own blog Godwins Law is triggered when the Nazis are invoked in characterizing ones opponents in the present debate. I wasnt replying to him. It just means that he took a short cut in order to receive the title of Dr. without the usual formation that goes with the typical doctoral program. Mary K we were posting at the same time, but I hereby declare that it applies to you, too. There were disagreements as well over the Old Testament Canon. It is not required that the donor receive anything directly from the other party. 4. I spoke on the topic of the eternal law of progression in Mormonism in Anchorage this morning. I never do, but then, like I said, Im not as apt to jump on the conspiracy train. James White and Jimmy Akin have met on numerous occasions in a variety of formats and frankly it is White who ends up tossing red herrings to avoid dealing with the truth. You contradict yourself within this sentence. I dont remember Dr. White saying that Dr. Beckwith was a liar. And, yes, we would know that list through divine revelation, or guidance of the Holy Spirit. Slander is saying something not true, so perhaps you should consider what exactly youre saying before you go shooting your keyboard off. The Book of the Annals of the Kings of Israel Good question, Esau. I mean, after reading him, i see no real refutation or engaging with his points. 1:8). Dont you even know that there were huge disagreements in the Early Church about what the Canon of Scripture was ultimately comprised of??? I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpents cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ. Jerry, yet the same council says: Clark Im not interested in buying any bridges. Wow, big discovery. the mindset that occasioned those abuses Your post was very interesting, but I had the mischievous temptation as in Finding Nemo to say something like You know, for an expert in humor, that wasnt very funny. A Methodist who thinks that James White needs his mouth and especially his mind, washed out with soap. Phoenix, Arizona. The second hole is that your comment was in no way a response to mine. Where was the big long post by Jimmy Akin condemning this fellow? Any more conspiracy theories you want to lay down on us, or is the cannabis plant calling? Continue to Make Such a Big Deal about it in this one? Before anyone knew the state of what God had done (canon mediated), God infallibly knew the current state and content of canon (infallible). thread is over when Godwins Law is invoked anyway but long ago a corollary to the Law was proposed and accepted by Taki Quirk Kogama (quirk@swcp.com): Quirks Exception: Intentional invocation of this so-called Nazi Clause is ineffectual.. Jesus confronted the Pharisees as sacralists head-on with the coin problem. You might prove me wrong here though as I assume Im speaking the same language as you are, yet you claim to not understand. I have two kids to watch and put to bed. Sorry, 2nd not 1st Corinthians. While going over Calvins rebuttal of Sadoletos letter from 1539, I read a paragraph where Calvin held Sadoletos argument to a biblical standard. I admire your charity. We are all searching for Gods way, and all who are RC, OC, or Protestant know that Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, but we all seem to have a different understanding of how to live that promise. You have to expect to encounter such things with fallen human nature what it is. In other words, I have a list of books I say was divinely inspired. The Acts of the Kings of Israel[18] Kind of a DeVry Technical Institute for theology. And how binding is a modern fatwa? Ed, do YOU have an urge to say it depends on your interpretation? Your username is new to me. No one less pure, less true, less kind, less noble for having been a fellow traveler in our journey toward eternal life. ~from Learning Christ. I had to get over this idea that a material Church existing in time and place was somehow able to communicate spiritual blessings. I believe in a rational God. Compare the iconoclasm, similar views on divine election, disdain for priesthood, and belief that the individual can read scripture outside of any binding authoritative framework, and voila: Critical similarities between Reformed Christianity and Islam. If you understand that salvation Speaking of CHEAP DEBATE TACTICS TO AVOID THE REAL ISSUES, you seem to OVERLOOK the fact that it is JAMES WHITE resorting to CHEAP DEBATE TACTICS TO AVOID THE REAL ISSUES, but I guess THATS OKAY, huh???? In a pigs eye. Thanks, Jeremiah. youd have to find a more substantive angle of attack Your bad was imputing malicious intent on the most tenuous of circumstantial evidence. which requires a change of lifestyle to seal and validate one's salvation. Im being sarcastic to make a point. This is one of them. Reality. Registrant Phone:+1.9512424988 I will, therefore, just urge you 1] to grow deeply in the love and truth of the Lord Jesus Christ, bearing Gods fruit in every field of your life. Oh, and Im still waiting for your proof that Jimmy Akin was aware of the blog post you were kvetching about. Eric, oh the drama. As you have, I can see. I will try to be more circumspect in identifying my addressee. Islamists are the Nazis of the post-9/11 world Though i do think the actions taken by white are questionable at best, this is the perfect time to show what it means to be Catholic. For that matter WHY would someone go through the bother?. is unique, standing alone against all the Do you want a page count, or perhaps a list of sanctioned books? A quote for the ages. This is a very vague, generalized statement. The daily dying to self, the seeds of every moment are to die for the sake of the Kingdom which is Christ our Lord. Have you told the church yet Esau? I would hope that anyone involved in a debate, would do so with the intent of winning the debate. Either Catholics would react, thus proving his point, or they wouldnt, thus implying that its a reasonable comparison (after all, the Catholics didnt object.). Registrant Name:to attn. Your comment uhm I did post at least one specific theological question that White was asking has at least two holes in it. certain Baptist church in Kansas to picket GODWINS LAW has spoken. issue! I dont care to read about James Whites brilliant forays into apologetics in this thread. Face it, some folk get a kick out of kicking over ant hills. And then were gonna to Francis Beckwith! He was a murderer from the beginning and does not stand in truth, because there is no truth in him. It was a distortion. Many in the early church actually accepted the Epistle of Clement as Scripture it was read in Corinth for over a hundred years as Sacred Scripture after Clement died. The Laments for Josiah[20] He was also a critical consultant for the Lockman Foundation's New American Standard Bible. Esau, the claim was Whites supporters are either unable or unwilling to participate in a serious discussion. Such a claim is based on a negative view of SOME of his supporters on this forum and ignores the existence of supporters, perhaps to include those who haved posted on JA, who have been and/or are otherwise willing to participate in serious discussion were it not for the hostilities and dismissiveness present on the JA forum. Just what is it about certain combinations of notes that make us feel sad, where others make us feel happy? Indulgences? Or can I just copy and paste your repeated (para-)phrase of nobody has addressed Whites points, and put my name in place of Whites? Does the Bible come with an owners manual? Is the Roman Mass a Propitiatory Sacrifice? I was a baptist (Reformed) What horrors are you referring to? I suppose such a thing fits the logic and attitude of the mob though. Whites response is twofold: Also, would you care to explain why I just got finished watching a clip from a debate where a Roman Catholic priest, holding two doctorates, purposefully misquotes Augustine in a bid to defend magesterium and is corrected by White? The Pharisees were definitely into winning, but here they pulled a loser because they didnt get the kingdom concept, that its about the heart, not the housing, be it political, institutional, or otherwise. This is as preposterous as the fringe left equating serious Christian belief with Islamic fundamentalism. if asked specifically.) As there is nowhere else exactly the same fact, so there is nowhere else exactly the same fallacy. Jimmy was born in Texas, grew up nominally Protestant, but at age 20 experienced a profound conversion to Christ. Simply Amazing, and the vitriol (no one can argue the level of hatred) expressed towards White by dozens of posters is fanaticism is fanaticism. The Bible & the Quran: Which is the Light to the World? At any rate, folks need only consult the Amazing. They died long ago, so they dont know anything. Or less substantive. Finally, I would like to make some comments regarding James Whites supposed openness to the truth. But thank you for your interaction. Fundementalists follow the Hadith and traditions of Islam which explain put the Quran in its context. Alpha and Omega Ministries is a Christian apologetics organization based in Phoenix, Arizona. Thats the analogy Im trying to draw here someone who really thinks this kind of thing is acceptable is not going to be a worthwhile interlocutor. They. Dont you? He will not win any to his way of thinking by using these pictures. StubbleSpark, I get your point, but I would disagree with the word deserve. Youve been violating logic almost as often as you call upon it. Not much difference there. He chose many disciples. OK by you? We deserve the pictures. Ed, thanks for the laugh. Jesus wants me to be rich. The word hypocrisy comes to mind with this double standard (to put it mildly). How does one handle the existing situation where different people/groups disagree on what books are a part of the Canon? $25. White portrayed X (Roman Catholics demanding charity and giving none) to Y (a picture of a Muslim demanding charity or calling for a beheading). The Book of Shemaiah For all thats worth. (Matt 18 anyone.) That alone should be enough to appease some people but as of this writing, the pictures are still there. Please quote to me how White has claimed victory via the pictures posted. If its good enough to post on a ministry blog, then its good enough for the other media. I have four of my own to get in bed. And the bread that we break is it not the partaking of the body of the Lord? (1 Cor. Isnt this the kind of answers that Roman Catholic apologists hate? that promised) Hebrews 10:23, Nobody can Do Catholics get better seats in heaven than the Protestants? I really dont know how to respond to this one, as Im laughing a bit too hard. Im not to apt to jump on the conspiracy train as you are. Perhaps you should take the plunge too Esau. Martin Luther is an ally on this question. As Zack was pastoring in the summer 2012, he was awakened to the abortion holocaust and has never been the same since. Wouldnt they then be more intruiged to find out more about him, seeing as you deem him important enough to name your apologetics website after him? Went almost two hours today but its an important program. Given that Guardian shows up, posts a URL out of the blue, vanishes and four hours later White has an angry post up, it does stink. Posted by: Foxfier | Aug 14, 2007 1:10:05 PM That you cant understand that displays that you are ignoring the facts in order to fiegn disgust, or youre just plain unable to deduce facts reasonably from the current situation. I think there is also a misunderstanding on what the word Charity means. Theres way more to Sola Scriptura then that, but what was cited was enough. I have a list of books I say was divinely inspired. Esther BELIEVES the Gospel has eternal life, which can never be forfeited or The two actions are neccesarily linked in fulfilling the one purpose of God. Mary Kay, If anyone wants to discuss the matter of the humor in Dr. Whites picture in a serious and polite manner, please, feel free to e-mail me. (Two concepts you would do well to look into developing in yourself). You can find him, as well as many from Apologia, serving on public sidewalks outside of abortion clinics and preaching the gospel publicly in multiple venues around the greater Phoenix area. Mike Petrik- Dude, chill. Rhetoric and emotionalism on both sides. Finally I see now the ruse!!! That would be me calling you a liar, yes? Funny, it looks a lot more like it than not putting the piece of paper out there. It was very gracious of you to paint Dr. White as an Islamic fundamentalist. Whether books like Baruch was inspired and others. Houston, Texas, Road Trip Schedule February 14, 2023 Haughton, Louisiana, Road Trip Schedule Tullahoma, Tennessee, Comparing the meaning and application of jot and tittle from Matthew 5:18 with the assertions of Peter Van Kleeck, The Insufficiency of Scripture by Andy Stanley, Radio Free Geneva: Frank Turek, Norm Geisler, David Allen, Why You Cant Have a Gas Stove, Then Mormonism 101Part 1, Lets Bring the Light of Gods Truth to Jehovahs Witnesses, The Death of Joseph Ratzinger, the Eternal Covenant in the London Baptist Confession, New Year Laws in California Show Deep Commitment to the Culture of Death, The Pillays of South Africa, Self-Made Energy Crisis, Response to Derrick Brite, Thomas Aquinas, Cornelius Van Til, Greg Bahnsen, A Quick Note on Categories and Endorsements, Wisdom for Future AmericansAnd all Peoples. As you know, all of us Catholics believe in Caritas in all things ). Through the church, couldnt tell you the location and Id be interested to see your answer, and to the church yet again. Sacralism is a paradigm of absolute unity between church and state that could not, would not distinguish between material, institutional trappings of human magesterial authority and the spiritual realities of the heavenly kingdom. Road Trip Dividing Line from Texas: Special Revelation, Natural Revelation, and Some Inseparable Operations posted by James White on February 23rd, 2023. aomin.org. Finally, these photos seem to me to be on the level of what you see on supermarket tabloid covers funny despite their offensiveness, but in a way that does not reflect particularly well on their creators and sponsors. I didnt really get his analogy, carebear. Good idea, though. righteousness of God, which is without works of any sort, But to him I am one who in fact still holds a debt against someone who once intentionally did me great harm and never repented. I said that it was pointless to discuss with people who thought that what James White did with those cartoons was defensible. You can certainly make changes to this design and add your own touches to make this more personal. which promote a false understanding of what it Biblically means to repent. But all your laborious pixel-squirting has failed to obscure the fact White made a hideously stupid comparison. At Alpha Tattoos and Piercings we will be providing you the highest quality, custom Tattoos and Piercing in a relaxing, clean environment. Very few are actually about the pictures. I will not do so. warning from God not to add or subtract from His Words. We dont want to go there again. It took a while, but I found it: I guess they follow the lead of their shepherd, Akin. 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